Tobi3102 wrote: ^ "First off, I don't like Davina, the teenage bitch witch." This already shows us how bias you are. I knew from the second I read that first sentence, you were going to say Bonnie is more powerful, despite the points I made in my last post. I didn't even have to read the rest of your post to know what you would say (though I actually did) You're of course, entitled to your opinion of any character, but still, it's pretty obvious your say is based on your bias towards Bonnie. If you rewatch Bonnie's fights and Davina's fights you will have to admit I made some pretty strong points. One of my pet peeves on this wiki is typing what I believe to be long arguement only for it to be completely ignored. Especially when the very next post is just one sentence saying "expression is > than 100 witches" (212, I'm speaking directly to you) Not that I expect everyone to agree with me just because I believe I made good points, but if someone opposses me, I'd love to hear a counter argument. I'll post my main points again and I'd like to see if anyone can argue against them. I know, I'm an attention whore, but again, my pet peeve is starting to kick in. * In most, if not all of Bonnie's encounters, she catches her opponents off gaurd. *Davina fights her opponents head on. *In one of her only head on fights, Bonnie could only hold Kol off long enough for her to make a get away, while Davina not only knocked Rebekah uncouncious, but wipped her memory of her location. * In addition, yes, Bonnie has more experiance (2 years v.s 8 months) but experiance>power isn't always the case and vice versa. Depending on the individual, sometimes raw power triumps, sometimes, it's experiance. *Now that Davina has been seen in the promo levitating several vamps and/or witches, it's getting harder for Team Bonnie to declare that Bonnie>Davina. At this rate, it will only get harder for them as the series progresses. Assuming of course, Davina doesn't die or lose her powers.
And, somehow your points are not supposed to say you are bias on Davina. So, according to you, levitating four vampires and breaking their bones/neck is much more powerful but bringing An Original down to his knees on the verge of death, causing severe pain, or to bring someone from death more than once, or to drop veil to the other side, which has existed for 2000 years is not powerful at all???
Also, to your point where Bonnies catches her enemy off guard but Davina fights her opponents head on: Was facing and fighting Alaric, Klaus on his body, protected by another witch, while holding her power was catching Alaric offguard? Or, maybe Making Elena throw out blood and bleed her and cause her pain was catching her opponent off guard? Or giving countless aneurysms to Damon and even burning him at one point was catching Damon off guard? Or, might I add, morifying Silas to stone was offguard? Where did you get that Idea???
Also, you say, Bonnie could only hold Kol off long enough for her to make a get away, while Davina not only knocked Rebekah uncouncious, but wipped her memory of her location. Becuase Bonnie knows what killing an Original does, the reason she protected Klaus in end of season four, and the reason that she doesn't want countless innocents to die on her petty revenge, unlike Davina who has no idea of what means killing an original and is just stuck on her revenge. Also, If Davina was that powerful, why should she hide in an attic?
And, about Bonnie has more experiance (2 years v.s 8 months) but experiance>power isn't always the case and vice versa. Why do people keep saying this? Davina knew fully from the beginning of her child and grew up knowing that she was a witch unlike Bonnie. If Davina didn't knew she was a witch then why would she be in The Harvest ritual? And, after being a witch for that long, and she has trouble doing a Simple Unlinking Spell that she has to get frustrated and re-read the spell and try more than once, isn't it a bit too loud to say that she is more powerful than Bonnie? I am only saying this, because, Bonnie did The Unlinking Spell using blood of The Five Originals in one go and we all know that using magic to affect an Original is not an easy task.
But, all in all, I think Davina is a very powerful witch herself, just that Bonnie is a shade bit more!
So, I welcome to more your good made points. Do care to say in which context, I haven't made equally as good point as yours. Nothing personal, am just clarifying your arguements.
Bonnie literally dragged Klaus in Elena's house and locked him! Controll of that extent is much more advanced than just normal throwing around using Telekinesis used by Davina! Also, Hurting and bringing an Original down to their kness and causing them pain is very much more advanced which Bonnie seems to do so at ease. Davina had to break the windows and shake an entire church just to break a bone of Klaus and he was't even on his knees. That just says that Bonnie has more power than Davina!!
The form of Magic Davina uses is limited to one place only, whereas Bonnie's is not. Bonnie can do Spirit Magic, Dark Magic, Expression. All Davina can do is use Ancestral Magic which also she doesn't seem to be able to control it. Beside, we have seen Bonnie channeling a 100 witches power very firmly. Also, Expression didn't kill Bonnie, going against The Will Of Nature, combining three magics killed her. Also, Bonnie has been channeling nature and her own magic since the beginning. So, Davina should infact, learn from her., eeing how Bonie has been using her own magic and getting stronger, being able to channel three powerful talismans, doing spells of great power on her own, she would be more powerful and great mentor to Davina. Sorry, but as I see it, Davina doesn't come anywhere near how strong Bonnie is, not with expression or just simple Spirit Magic and Dark Magic alone!
Also, I can't help but noticing that ancestreal magic is similar to that used in the Secret Circle. Both require and call for the power endowed by their ancestors (just a note). I hope that they do incorperate some more ideas from TSC into the new series just to make up for it's cancellation
Its true! But, Mystic Falls may have been founded at that time, but Witches there lived more earlier than that. The fact that The Originals themselves were created there, and Powerful Witches like Ayana and Esther lived there is a proof. Also, Davina has access to a huge amount of power but lacks control, I wish she could control. It would be awesome! But, then, I still maintain my sentence- Bonnie is way more powerful than Davina!
I agree with you.
Anyway, I decided to stop discussing until we see Davina's individual power. People (including myself) are tend to ignore the fact that both witches are currently fueled up by exterior forces. Though until proven otherwise, I will always believe Davina is stronger because her help is only 3 other girls. But I'm not going to discuss.
Esther invented the Unlikning Spell with a Sanguin Knot, the first most complex yet easiet way. When later she linked five orginal, it was more complex one and Bonnie undid it. Not Esther, Bonnie. Beside, Bonnie did a body-swap of Klaus on Tyler's body, which previously required two powerful witches (Maddox and Greta). Also, why do keep saying Davina has the power of three dead witches? She herself explained that she was just a normal ordinary witch, but when The Harvest was done, and her three friends were sacrificed, All the powers that were supposed to go on earth linked onto each other and finally linked on Davina, giving her access to The Ancestral magic which has been running for decades in New Orleans. If you think I'm just making it up, why don't you go and read Davina's page here. And, you are right, unless they show some more powers of Davina, I refuse to believe that she is more powerful than Bonnie. At the least, she should do some spell on her own, not anyone else's power, but on her own.
Here's what I think and its my personal opinion. Back then, when Jeremy was shot by Liz, Bonnie had Jeremy's body and Jeremy was wearing The Giblert Ring. And Bonnie was just trapping Jeremy's spirit and bringing him back from death. The witches said there would be consequences but never said Bonnie was going against The Will Of Nature. However, in the later, Bonnie had to bring the whole body of Jeremy, twisting the events of Reality, cause you know, Jeremy's body was long gone. People knew Jeremy was dead and it had been a while. So, maybe the time factor and all that stupid Body factor must have some effects, not just entirely magic!! Again, its my opinion.
Rather than Bonnie dying because she combined three magics, I think its more like the Nature found balance by Making Jeremy alive but instead keeping Bonnie dead. And, isn't that the very thing Damon is trying to do now? So, I don't think Bonnie died because she overused expression, but just because she challenged the Will Of Nature.
Davina did not do much damage to Klaus because she couldn't risk hurting Tim who was in the way, held by Klaus as leverage. If she accepted sacrificing Tim, she would have made a fine damage to Klaus. But she had to go for intimidation, which didn't work on Klaus at the time. Davina was able to boil the blood of one, a spell according to Agnes elders did back in the 19th century. But you know what she did to Rebekah. Silas had 2000 years of honing his senses and abilities, and Sage was 900 years old vampire who entered Rebekah's brain when she was asleep. So considering those ages, a 16 year old girl entering an original's brain is kind of a big deal.
Besides, Klaus is a weak pansy ass black sheep original who begs to anyone when his precious life is threatened.
Bonnie did pain infliction and could have killed Klaus, but she would die in the process. Marcel asked Davina to find a way to kill an original, which in my opinion means if given enough time, she could indeed find and exploit without dying in the process.
The four sacrifice rejuvenate the power of the witches, enough for 300 years. I hardly think the 3dead witches power is enough to sustain an entire coven of witches with powers for 300 years. So, Davina is not just channeling 3dead witches, but the entire of Ancestral Magic. Otherwise, why will all the witches loose their power? Because, right now, Davina is the only intermediate for the access to Ancestral Magic, the core reason why she is able to sense when witches perform magic. When Katie used magic,Davina felt it through her body, not how a normal witches sense. Remember when Bonnie sensed Lucy, it was through vibes, not like a pansy girl having orgasms calling out names.
And, as for Davina interferring Rebekkah's mind, she simply did a spell that erased her memory, and considering her power, its not much a deal. Fine, she was able to boil blood from within, but, I would really like to see her give aneurysm, like Bonnie did. That would count as inflicting some real pain, not some stupid blood boiling like having fever and ropping a line of sweat.
And, if you are really comparing powers between Davina and Bonnie, the latest episode already cleared. Davina had to perform more than once to do a simple unliking spell, but Bonnie unliked five originals on one go, a spell performed by a 1000years old witch herself. And, Elijah did say that Unliking Spell was one of the powerful spell of Esther she later invented. So, Bonnie is powerful.
As fas as killing an original is concerned, its either White Oak Stake or Immortality Reversal Spell, which can only be performed by The Original Witch. When Esther and the witches for 1000 years hasn't been able tp find any other ways to kill an orginal, I hardly doubt a 16 year old mediocre who can't control her own magic will be able to find a way. Though, it depends on the writers of the series. Also, killing an original will kill their entire bloodline which means Marcel will also die, so, I don't think Davina would want her sweet protector Marcel to die.
Give it another season we'll find out they are not natural from some other supernatural race.
Im actually thinking they are the only natural species.They would destroy five seasons of cannon if they make the witches a not-meant creation of some other species.They stated that they are the servants of nature,meaning nature created them,meaning they are natural.Changing that would ruin everything they said so far about them.
I personally love the witches,they seem so layered and are by far better villains than marcel and his posy.
I agree with you. I love witches too! And, personally, if there were no Witches, there wouldn't be Vampires at all. Witches are the servants of nature and has magical power. Now, one or two witch, out of desperation and love, go against the nature and created Immortals and Vampires. Naturally being the Servants of Nature, they will fight against. And, beside, you need a good catalyst and antagonist. Just having mere Vampires would be really boring!
Davina is definitely not related to Qetsiyah. She might be related to Esther, but then, the reason behind her power is the Powers of Ancestral Magic of over 300 years that she has when the 3 witches died.
I am just saying this, please don't mind, but you should probably see The Original again, the part where Davina explains The Harvest ritual. It was after the ritual that she got all powers, not just of 3 witches, but The Ancestral Magic, powers of over 300 years or maybe even more. Should Bonnie have only her powers, then Davina should try fighting on her own powers too. And, its pretty clear Bonnie has the upper hand, despite having expression or not!
And, also about what Bonnie did with 100 dead witches was she inflicted so much pain to Klaus, that he was practically in his death bed, begging Elijah to save him. And, Davina, with 3 dead witches and ancestral magic of over 300 years, just blew the entire windows of the church and broke one bone of Klaus. How does Davina become powerful now?
Silas told that Expression is a form of magic very powerful enough, only pulled by strong witches and he thinks Bonnie can do it! So, there you go, Expression does need powerful witches!
Bonnie was able to perform unliking spell put by Esther on five Originals without any help at one go. She didn't have access to witch spirits or expression at the moment. While, for Davina, she got frustrated and had to practise more than once just to do a simple unlikning spell between a werewolf and a power-compromised witch.
Bonnie doesn't need expression. She was able to pull body transformation spell, unlinking spell and so many others with her normal powers. And, Davina with the access of 300 years of power can't perform a single spell properly without blowing glass and shaking rooms. I don't think she's that powerful at all. At any given point, Davina will be crushed by all the Bennett Witches and Esther!! :P
1- When she had 100 dead witches, she throwing Klaus around was considered an act of strength, despite it forced Bonnie a lot and her nose bled. Davina got three girls' powers, yet she shows more strength.
2- Why are you comparing expression Bonnie and normal Davina? Think about Davina's strength if she resorted to darkness or expression. She could destroy the entire planet in mere seconds (in a manner of speaking).
3- Ancestrial magic channels to the bloodline. That's why it needs to be restored every now and then. Spirit magic has access to all spirits. And Davina shows more strength despite that handicap.
Davina doesn't just have the power of the three witches. She has the power of the ancestral magic which has been running for over 300 years. The Harvest ritual is performed every 300 years and when the witches are killed, all the powers are linked as one. So, obviously, Davina seems stronger but, she doesn't seem to handle it well. I mean obviously, she had to blast the whole church just to break one bone of Klaus???
Then again, I can see your point, because Jeremy did discuss the whole balance of nature thing with Damon, saying how Bonnie's dead because he's not suppossed to be alive or something like that. Maybe Bonnie surviving one ressurection and not the other is just a plot hole.
All in all, I think Bonnie died because she combined three magics to go against the will of nature, and she did. but like always nature found a balance, where there is death, there will always be death. So, jeremy is back, but bonnie is dead, which also maybe a punishment for her for going against the will of nature.