Stefan with his humanity turned off would fit in pretty well with Klaus, considering their previous dynamic. However, seeing how The Originals is building up Dahlia, having any of the members of TVD show up would be distracting and detrimental to the plot.
@Actionmanrandell, I just want to say this first... please learn to use the shift key and capitalize your sentences. Reading your posts is irritating as hell because everything is lower case.
Secondly, Michael Narducci, despite your personal feelings of him, is the show runner along with Julie Plec. That means they have final say on what happens on The Originals. And yes, he does write the episodes. Maybe not the whole thing, but he's in that writing room, throwing out ideas, along with Plec and the other writers. It's the same with The Vampire Diaries and Caroline Dries. I'll admit, loudly, that I don't like her, but she has final say on what happens on that show, whether we like it or not.
Thirdly, I've read a lot about vampires... long before this show even existed and while I don't pretend to be an expert on the subject of the undead, I don't recall much mythology about vampires getting stronger by drinking vampire blood. Actually, I don't recall any mythology on the subject. Vampires feed on human blood because they're dead and their own blood can't sustain them. That's the whole point of vampires: they suck the life out of you because they're not alive themselves. So a vampire feeding on another vampire would probably make them weaker.
Fourthly, I've already given an example of when a full moon werewolf took down a vampire. The very argument you tried to use against the werewolves was Jules and Rose. Jules, while in wolf form, knocked down and bit Rose, a 550+ year old vampire. And then there was the Guerrera wolves, which I've already mentioned, empowered by their moonlight rings, who took down Marcel's entire army. But if you need more examples, I'll continue, like with Mason who easily took down Caroline and probably would have killed her if Stefan and then Tyler hadn't interceded.
And, finally, I wish to apologize to the OP for mentioning Klaus and Mikael as an example for comparison against Dahlia and Esther... this has gotten so far from the original question.
Actionmanrandell wrote:
Toe Knee 17 wrote:
wrong. a hyrbid is not actually stronger than a vampire or werewolf. this is how it works. while in his normal form. klaus is just any normal original. he has the strength that all originals have. when he gets mad he begins to draw upon his werewolf side which gives him a boost of power and i mean a slight boost not a huge one because werewolfs are never that strong compared to vampires. not even a full moon wolf is as strong as a vampire. Rose easily tossed full moon jules off her like she was a feather. its only that a werewolf bite is toxic to a vampire. and as such one bite can end it. as such klaus is not actually stronger than mikael add to that mikael was the first to become a vampire, since he is the father he likely consumed tatia's blood first and died first so that he was stronger. also he has spent 1000 years eating nothing but vampires. on the vampire diaries they show that a vampire who drinks only vampire blood is actually stronger than a normal vampire and as such that means mikael is always going to be stronger than klaus. every time they fight he always over powers klaus. never once did klaus actually overpower him. not even when he was pissed and releasing the wolf in him slightlyÂ
No. I just stated above, and it was confirmed by another contributor, that Michael Narducci, one of the people in charge of the TVD/TO universe, has said that Mikael feeding on vampires had absolutely nothing to do with his strength in comparison to his children. If it did, I'm sure Klaus would be well known for his vampire-eating habits by now.
Secondly, it has been confirmed, more than once, that a werewolf on the night of the full moon is stronger than a vampire, with the exception of the Originals. That was the whole reason Esther made her children into the creatures they now are, so they would be stronger than the werewolves. Your reference of Jules and Rose doesn't work because Rose didn't throw Jules off. Jules was busy chomping down on Rose's shoulder and then Damon swung in with a sword, stabbing Jules and driving her away. Either way, Jules wasn't trying to kill her outright, just bite her to introduce the toxin to her system.
Another proof of the fact that werewolves are stronger than vampires on the night of the full moon is the season finale of season one of The Originals, where the Correas/Guerreras got their moonlight rings, thereby getting all the strength and speed they would have gotten on the full moon, and then they overpowered Marcel's army of vampires... and that was just five of them.
In conclusion, we don't know what makes Mikael stronger than Klaus, but I'm sure we'll continue to come up with plausible scenarios until we stumble across something that makes the most sense.
^Ain't that the damn truth!
Mgc26133 wrote: Mikael feeds on vampire blood. That may boost his power or something. I'm not sure how that works.
I thought Julie Plec confirmed that his diet of vampire blood didn't make him any stronger than his children. At least, that's what I heard, I don't have a source to back it up with.
^I'm not saying that Mikael isn't strong in his own right. I'm just saying that Klaus is technically stronger, even if only by a small margin. And a psychological advantage can translate pretty well in a physical fight. Klaus spent his entire life up until three years ago terrified of this man's mere name, let alone how he was overpowered by him numerous times. That sense of fear can cripple someone, whether they wan tot admit it or not.
Toe Knee 17 wrote:
Except, Mikael is more powerful than Klaus...
Technically, Klaus (as the Original Hybrid) is physically stronger than Mikael as he has the strength of both a vampire and a werewolf on his side. Mikael's strength, while impressive, isn't what results in his triumphs over Klaus. That's purely psychological. Despite any claims otherwise, Klaus is terrified of his father and this gives Mikael the advantage. Also, as we've seen, Mikael has a pretty strong will, especially when it comes to pain as evident by Tunde's dagger. But that is also psychological, as was semi-explained in that episode where he pulled it out.
In Norse culture, children were named, such as Elijah, and then their last name would be the name of their father + son, as we've seen. Example: Elijah Mikaelson. So, for Mikael, whatever his father's name was would be his last name. Meaning, if Mikael's father was named Gunnar, his full name would be Mikael Gunnarson.
JEK wrote: ^Ah, Abyssal, you speak the sort of passive-aggressive truth, as almost always. Missed you!
What can I say, I was raised by women. (no offense)
64.229.71.243 wrote:
It has nothing to do with Delena. Â The writers are consistently inconsistent, if you will. Â This happens with all the characters, with virtually every plotline. Â They basically rewrote TVD history last season with Silas/Amara. Â You guys are the ones constantly making it about Delena.
No, Caroline Dries is the one who keeps making it about Delena. We're just the ones that point it out. After all, this is a show about relationship drama, it just happens to involve vampires, witches and werewolves. Pretty much every plot device from the beginning was all about how to cause friction between Elena and whichever of the Salvatore boys she was with at the time. From Stefan being a vampire, to Stefan's blood addiction, to the sire bond, to the Doppelganger issue to the Travelers, etc. The list goes on and on, and at the center of that each time is Elena's relationship drama. I'll admit, I am not a fan at all of Delena, I personally think it's what brought this show down, but it's the truth.
Everything is about Delena. Take Alaric. Came back as this badass powerful vampire, but now he's human again just so that he can't uncompel Elena, thereby causing more pointless drama between Elena and Damon while everyone else is forced to the background. Hell, take this last episode that aired. Where was Bonnie? Stuck in a prison-dimension with a sociopathic mass murderer. You would think Damon would be trying to figure out a way to get her out, but no... he has to see Elena so they can make lovey-dovey eyes at one another.
Oh, the writer's have conveniently forgotten that Stefan is a blood-a-holic who can't have human blood without turning into a ripper. Mmhmm. That ship has sailed because it doesn't do anything to cause drama between Elena and Damon.
To respond to the OP, I almost totally agree. I'll still be watching the show because I've spent the last five years invested in this show, but The Originals really has taken over for the action and suspense that used to draw so many people to The Vampire Diaries. I mean, they (Caroline Dries and Julie Plec) have totally butchered the main characters in my eyes. I can't stand Caroline anymore, and she was my favorite character. Bonnie's self-sacrificing is no longer a tragedy but a boring predictability, Matt's constantly pushed to the side and Tyler's absent from more episodes than he's in. But at the end of the last season, when I heard that Alaric would be returning full-time, I was ecstatic. I loved Alaric, especially since he would be coming back as an Original. We would be able to see how something that powerful operates without having the noose that is the Mikaelson name tied around his neck.
But then this last episode happened. The only reason Alaric was returned to being human was to prolong the drama between Elena and Damon. That's it! The writers aren't even trying to hide the fact that everything about this show revolves around Delena. And this ticks me off on more than just the relationship drama, because Alaric had so much potential as an Enhanced Original, especially considering the White Oak Stake and the daggers didn't work on him.
I saw a lot of people arguing how Alaric couldn't go to The Originals because he has no relationship with any of them. I think we're all forgetting Esther here. She made Alaric into what he was. If anyone would/could bring Alaric to NOLA, it's Esther. It was even hinted at by Michael Narducci in an interview that Esther might make a play for him, seeing as how her ultimate goal is to erase vampires from the planet and Alaric is - I'm sorry, was the only vampire that couldn't be killed by the White Oak Stake. But now we'll never get to see what Esther could have done with him to get her children in line because the point is now moot. I mean, I for one, would have loved to have seen a full-blown battle between Alaric and Mikael.
I honestly don't think they'll introduce Skinwalkers, because we already have shape-shifters in the werewolves. And, truthfully, I don't want them to introduce Native American mythology. Don't get me wrong, I love indigenous mythologies, like the Native Americans and the Mesoamericans, but the thing that The Vampire Diaries and The Originals had going for them, was that they introduced their own mythology, not just taking actual myths and legends and twisting them around to fit the story.
@Killer Kev, and I would totally watch that. I'd say they could use Mystic Falls because vampires can't enter but then Bonnie couldn't be a witch. Granted, I'm sure somehow the writers will come up with a way for Mystic Falls to be a vampire safe-zone again.
No! I hate the idea of them together. I was perfectly happy with them as best friends, like Stefan and Lexi. Yes, that's a bit weird that he replaced one blond vampire with another as his best friend, but they're perfect as besties. It was one of the things I still loved about the show, how Caroline and Stefan, despite being an attractive woman and man on this show, didn't want to jump each other. I liked that they pretty much balanced each other out, but as friends, nothing romantic.
Lord knows, there's enough romantic drama just from Elena and Damon.
67.169.206.24 wrote: I dont like tyler. I have my reasons. But the main one for me is, tyler ultimately gets in the way or has dissapeared. Season 1 and 2 he was a jerk. Season 3 he is gone for some or was pushing people away. Season 4 he's not really there either. He just pushes his limits. I think caroline should find someone new. She deserves better.
I don't want to sound argumentative here, but I'm going to disagree with your entire statement. Like I said, not argumentative, because I'm sure you have your reasons that you don't like Tyler. My guess is you're a Klaroline shipper or something, and there's nothing wrong with that. But I don't like the way you just shrugged him off as just getting in the way or being a jerk.
Yes, in season one he was an asshole. He was supposed to be. He was the stereotypical jock-douche. If you've ever read the book (which I don't actually recommend - they're nothing like the show and they got WAY to weird) than you'll know that Tyler was an ass there too. I don't really see where the whole "getting in the way" thing comes in. And every time he's disappeared for a few episodes, it had something to do with the plot of the story and the individual growth of his character. Personally, I just think the writers don't know what to do with his character.
I mean, in season two he disappeared to A.) get his new status as a werewolf under control, and B.) he was ashamed, scared and angry. Or, at least, that's how I see it. Look at it from his point of view. Caroline, this girl who is so nice and understanding, helping him through something he believes no one else will ever understand and it turns out that she knew, the entire time he was freaking out, that his uncle was dead and that it was Damon who killed him. Caroline may not have actually been in on that, but she knew and kept it a secret from Tyler the entire time.
Season three he was sired to the world's most unoriginal Original, making him do things that he didn't really want to do, such as laying traps for his friends and biting Caroline. I want everyone to remember that one because it was Klaus who told him to do it, invoking the power of the sire bond. He left to be his own person again, without any outside influences so that he could come back and be with Caroline without hurting her. Then, in season four, he and the other unsired hybrids tried to take him down for good, with Tyler offering his own body as the means to do it. If anything, Tyler is the most heroic character on the show, especially after he sticks around after Klaus murdered his pack and his mother, while the other hero-protectors of Mystic Falls stuck their heads in the sand and pretended nothing happened because Klaus may or not be useful for this whole cure-hunt.
Your last statement, about Caroline deserving someone better... I'm conflicted on that. Don't get me wrong, I loved Caroline! She was my favorite character on the show, until this last season. The entirety of season five was just Caroline being a total bitch, what with constantly hounding Tyler to come join them at college because it's what she wanted him to want, then getting mad at him when he went off to try and take down Klaus, giving him that ultimatum that girls hate to have thrown at them. Then, down the road, she sleeps with Klaus, the guy who murdered half the town during one of his temper-tantrums because he couldn't get what he wanted, not to mentioning killing "the love of her life's" mother as well as driving him away with the fear of constantly having to look over his shoulder.
If anything, at this point, Tyler deserves better. If - well, more a question of when, really - Caroline gets with Stefan, and Elena somehow gets Damon back, I want the other characters, Tyler, Matt, Jeremy and Bonnie to go on a get a better life with better people in it.
I think it's going to be a bit of a step down at first. So many witches were so used to getting that extra power boost from the Spirits and have actually lost touch with Traditional Magic. Personally, I think that would be an interesting storyline to follow, especially if they bring the twins back. I mean, you have Liv and Luke, who were pretty powerful, as admitted by Bonnie, who suddenly don't have the Spirits to back them up anymore. Any witch who relied solely on the Earth, of even witches who practiced Dark Magic will be stronger now.
Though, I did watch an interview with Julie Plec, and she said the aftereffects of the collapse of the Other Side were probably going to be felt more on the Originals than the Vampire Diaries.
I, personally, want her to succeed. Logically I know this will never happen because The Originals revolves around... gasp, the Originals. We're already one down with Rebekah gone, leaving only Elijah and Klaus. Granted, now we have Finn and Esther and Mikael running around, but I digress.
I loved Davina. I thought she was a nice change of pace for a witch in this universe. Witches are generally painted as the good guys who do bad things for the greater good. I liked that the New Orleans Coven was the main antagonist of The Originals. Don't get me wrong, I'm Team Witch all the way, but the witches of the Quarter tried to murder Davina. Marcel rescued her and took care of her for the next eight months/year. Yes, he was also using her to keep the witches suppressed, but that's besides the point. They genuinely cared about each other.
Right now, she has Mikael bound to her will. Theoretically, if she can sever the bloodline, she can let Mikael out and then "dispose" of him after Klaus is dead, either by killing him or locking him away, maybe desiccating him like Abby did. Naturally, this won't happen, because this is a supernatural drama, but it would be nice. Klaus is a horribly evil person. He has his moments, but in the end, he is a narcissistic, ego-centric psychopathic megalomaniac. I don't think he can be redeemed and after all the hell he's put countless victims through, I think he deserves some comeuppance.
67.207.249.111 wrote:
What the hell do you mean Epic love?Â
Caroline was IN LOVE WITH TYLER, not Klaus. Klaus is a horrible person. He had a rough past, but it doesn't make up for the horrible things he did to innocent people along the way. THERE IS NO EXCUSE. Caroline wanted to be with Tyler and Klaus would Not allow it. DOES THAT SOUND LIKE A MAN INVOLVED IN AN EPIC LOVE? Epic Love with WHO? Caroline never loved him, and she never liked him.
Caroline had SEXUAL ATTRACTION to Klaus. The only reason they had sex in the woods after Caroline Told Klaus to never see her ever again was because the writers wanted to END any questions about them ever being together and finally calm down the insane Klaroline shippers. It will never happen.
Tyler was a total douche in season 1 but he never injured or killed anyone out of pleasure. He did NOT deserve the horrible things Klaus made happen. Sired hybrid? Who Klaus forced to bite Caroline and then swooped in to save the day? Chasing Tyler out of town. Killing his mother. Tyler was Caroline's lover and Klaus tortured him. Have some common sense. Klaus was the cockblocker.
Yes! Thank you! Someone else finally gets it. Klaus is, without a doubt, the WORST possible choice for anyone to have a romantic relationship with. Klaroline shippers usually scream, "But he loved her!" Hell, Klaus didn't even love himself. How the hell is he able to love another person? He doesn't get his way, he kills off entire families. What happened with Tyler and the hybrids and his mother is the same thing that Klaus did to Katherine. They one-upped him and he threw an epic temper tantrum.
Since this was originally about why people dislike Tyler, I'll answer that as well. In season one, I didn't really like Tyler. I didn't hate him, like I did Damon, but I didn't like him either, what with the whole Vicki thing and then the thing with Vicki and Matt's mom, but he was based on Tyler Smallwood in the books. He was supposed to be the stereotypical asshole jock. I liked his storyline in season two, what with triggering the curse and becoming a werewolf. That was terrific acting on Michael Trevino's part. Personally, he and Bonnie were my favorite characters from the show, along with Jeremy and Matt. Mostly, I think it was for spite, because the writers like to put SO much time and effort into the main trio and Caroline. Don't get me wrong, I loved Caroline... until season five. It was all downhill for her there.
But, as I was saying, the reason I like Tyler and Bonnie so much, is because the writers just love to torture them. It's Tyler and Bonnie who have suffered the most out of all the cast members, losing their entire families, their identities, even their lives, all for the sake of their friends. But that's just my opinion.
Original Authority wrote: Well, there isn't a reason we should doubt Mikael, he is the oldest Original, thus strongest. Everybody thinks Klaus is the strongest, but as Rebekah stated, Mikael is the only thing that Klaus fears.
Klaus, doesn't have power really, if you think about it, Esther was able to render his werewolf side dormant. This would make Finn and Elijah stronger due to age. If it was that easy for Esther to accomplish, what makes you think somebody like Davina couldn't do it.
I don't think the actual ages of the Originals factors into their strength level. I mean, yes, Mikael was changed in his, I wanna say fifties. Finn and Elijah in their thirties, Klaus and Kol in their twenties and then Rebekah in her late teens. I don't think that really changes their strength level because they were all changed at the same time. At least, that's how I've always seen it. It was vampire age, not actual age that determined strength.
For example, Stefan and Damon were both turned at the same time, and yes, Damon was the stronger out of the two, but that's because he drank human blood while Stefan drank animal blood. Once Stefan became a ripper again, and was once again feeding on human blood, he was able to easily match Damon, blow for blow.
I agree that, physically, Mikael is above the others, if not Klaus because of his Hybrid status. The reason I think this is because Mikael feeds on vampires, not humans. In the books especially, Katherine and Klaus were so powerful because they fed on humans and vampires. So, Mikael, taking in the blood of a being stronger than a human, should be stronger in turn.